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. . . which is actually a good thing, I suppose.

I spoke with a bunch of attorneys recently to get a sense of where things stand. Here is what I learned.

Jerrold Jensen, Utah assistant attorney general, told me that last week Third District Judge Denise Lindberg held a teleconference with the attorneys. Jensen said the judge thought things would be progressing faster.

Bill Richards, assistant attorney general for Arizona, proposed holding a two-day meeting with all parties to see if a settlement can be reached. Lindberg agreed and ordered the meeting to occur within 60 days.

Richards told me ''we are in process." I spoke to him a day before a scheduled ''fact-gathering visit'' to the twin towns, where he planned to meet with ''as many people as I can and governmental leaders to get input on what is going on with the trust.''

Who is at the settlement table: Representatives for the FLDS, representatives for the nonFLDS, Bruce Wisan and his attorneys, and representatives of the Utah and Arizona attorney generals' offices. It is a crowded table.

Greg and Roger Hoole have argued they should be at the table, too, though some see that as a conflict since they are handling the civil lawsuit against the trust that is pending before another judge.

Greg Hoole told me he and Roger are representing the Lost Boys and Brent Jeffs, whose lawsuits forced the takeover of the trust and remain part of the beneficiary class.

''NonFLDS make up a significant percentage of that beneficiary class,'' he said. ''Our clients are at least interested to ensure that the rights of all class members are protected in these settlement discussions.''

One interesting tidbit: Although Wisan negotiated a settlement with the Lost Boys/Jeffs along time ago, the property he agreed to give them has yet to be transferred. Greg Hoole told me his firm sent the trust a letter last month asking that the titles be handed over.

Meanwhile, Elissa Wall's civil lawsuit is still in the discovery phase. ''We clearly do not think that it is [part of the stand down],'' Greg Hoole told me. ''We don't think Judge Lindberg has authority to stay a case over which she is not presiding and has no jurisdiction.''

''We're anxious to push that forward as expeditiously as possible so Elissa Wall can have her day in court,'' Greg Hoole said.

Jensen told me that about 300 people turned out for the town hall meeting in Centennial Park a few weeks ago. He said the meeting was ''outstanding.'' One viewpoint expressed: Don't turn property over to those who created the problems in the first place.

One outcome of that meeting was the appointment of four individuals to represent views of nonFLDS in the trust settlement talks. Those four are: Stephanie Colgrove, Richard Holm, Art Blackmore (Carolyn Jessop's father) and Sam Zitting.

Jensen has also met numerous times with FLDS spokesman Willie Jessop, the first opening with the FLDS in the four years since involvement of the AG's office began. ''We welcomed the opportunity and have been listening,'' he said.

One position that the AG's office is "adamant" about: Recording the subdivision plats for the twin cities and giving people deeds to their properties.

Jensen said more problematic is what to do about businesses and common property, such as Cottonwood Park.

He said he moves between optimism and frustration about finding a way through the mess.

Mark Callister, one of Wisan's attorneys, said much the same in an interview with me. He added that Wisan is ''taking into account" all concerns abut the trust's future.

And speaking from the FLDS' corner, attorney Jim Bradshaw said ''we're continuing to meet and going through a lot of issues and making some progress.''

Attorney Amy Hennington has submitted a motion to seal the deposition records, according to a clerk at the Tom Green County Courthouse.

The clerk told me that the motion is on the judge's desk but Judge Walther has not yet acted on it.

I emailed Jeff Schechter this morning to ask what his involvement, if any, might be in the FLDS case.

Schechter is a motivational/leadership/marketing guru. It was apparent to me from looking over his Web site he has nothing to do with the sect.

In my first email, I said his Web site was mentioned in a deposition involving a member of the FLDS church. ''Why? Do you have any connection to the sect?''

Here is what he told me:

''Ha. That's funny. I don't even know what FLDS stands for!''

So I emailed him again, and explained who the FLDS are and asked if he knew Merril Jessop.

Shecky wrote back: ''I have no idea who that is.''

Unanswered questions from Merril Jessop's Jan. 23, 2009, depositin, part three:

195. Do you know David Allred?
196. Where is R23 located?
197. Are you familiar with a company called United Land Company?
198. What is your relationship to a person named Lyle Jeffs?
199. Were you involved in the negotiation or sale of any land referred to as the Apple Valley land?
200. On page 191 there is a reference of a transfer of $40,000, wire transfer from bank to bank, do you have any understanding of what banks are being referred to?

201. Do you have an understanding of the meaning of the phrase, all consuming fire from heaven?
202. How many of your daughters have been married or sealed to Warren Jeffs?
203. How many of Warren Jeffs’ daughters been married or sealed to your sons?
204. Do you know if Warren Jeffs was in the habit of dictating his daily activities?
205. Have you heard of your daughter Naomie be referred to as a scribe?
206. Is there any property at the YFZ Ranch that is owned by the UEP Trust?
207. Have you ever had a default judgment entered against you?
208. Have you ever been advised by Warren Jeffs to allow a default judgment to be entered against you?
209. Who pays the utility bills at the YFZ Ranch?
210. Have you ever been instructed by Warren Jeffs to research how to get assets from the UEP trust to an entity in Texas on behalf of the Texas group?

211. Were you in contact with Warren Jeffs in March (23) of 2008?
212. And if this date is correct, is it your understanding that this was just shortly before law enforcement entered the ranch, which began their investigation?

213. Were you present at the ranch when law enforcement arrived to serve their search warrant?
214. When law enforcement arrived did you identify yourself as the leader or contact person to accept the search warrant on behalf of the ranch property?

215. Do you know Willie Jessop?
216. And when I say Willie Jessop, I'm speaking of William R. Jessop who is on the media at times. Does he have your authority to speak on behalf of you?

217. When Willie Jessop refers to him as spokesman of the FLDS do you know who his spokesman for, do you have an understanding of what he means?

218. Have you ever given him authority to speak on your behalf?
219. Do you know if any adult member of the FLDS has specifically given Willie Jessop authority to speak on their behalf?
220. Who within the FLDS would have the authority to appoint a spokesman for the group?
221. Hands Merril a stack of dictations and asks: Do these appear to be the kinds of records that are kept within the FLDS organization?

222. On the top of this first page it's dated Sunday, April 29, 2007, Letter Brother Wendell Nielsen and Brother Merril Jessop. Is it your understanding that you are the Merril Jessop to whom this is addressed?

223. Do you know if Teresa Jeffs is a member of the beneficiary class of the UEP Trust?
224. Do you know if Teresa Jeffs is a member of a beneficiary class of any trust in Texas associated with the FLDS group?
225. Do you know of any source of income or funds to which Teresa Jeffs is entitled?
226. Is there anyone within the FLDS group who can authorize the expenditure of funds for Teresa Jeffs towards education?

227. (Following questions asked by Jonathan R. Davis, attorney for a minor male sibling) What did you do when you left school?

228. Did you go to work when you left school?
229. Are you related to Warren Jeffs?
230. Is your daughter, Naomie, married to Warren Jeffs?
231. Is your daughter X, married to Warren Jeffs?
232. Do you know how Warren Jeffs provides support for your daughters financially?
233. Do you know who assigns housing to the residents at YFZ?
234. Does the FLDS provide support for Annette Jeffs and her children?
235. Do you provide support financially for Annette Jeffs of her children?
236. Are you aware of any sources of financial support for Annette Jeffs and her children?
237. Has Annette Jeffs ever asked you for support financially for her children or for herself?
238. Does Warren Jeffs have any real property interests of which you are aware?
239. Does Warren Jeffs have any interest in any businesses of which you are aware?
240. Are you aware of any financial support that Warren Jeffs might have provided to his wife, Annette, and her children since the time he was incarcerated?

241. Are you aware of any financial support that Warren Jeffs would have provided to Annette Jeffs and her children since the time of his incarceration?

242. Are you aware of whether Warren Jeffs has access to any bank accounts?
243. Are you aware of whether Annette Jeffs has any access to any bank accounts?
244. Are you aware of any incident occurring in the last five years of any individual within the FLDS community withholding intentionally medical care for another member of the FLDS community?

245. How does a purchaser go to acquire groceries there? Do they pay for it in money or how do they pay for it?
246. Who has access to use that storehouse?
247. Can Annette Jeffs access that storehouse to obtain groceries?
248. Who finances the storehouse?
249. Is there a school at the YFZ Ranch?
250. Who oversees the school at the YFZ Ranch?
251. What is the source of the curriculum of the school at the YFZ Ranch?
252. When is the school at the YFZ Ranch in session?
253. How many hours are the children in school each day?
254. What courses are taught at that school?
255. Who selects the teachers for the school at the YFZ Ranch?
256. How are the teachers at the school at the YFZ Ranch selected?
257. How many teachers are teaching at that school?
258. Are there any teachers at that school who are not members of the FLDS?
259. Have the children attending that school been tested by standardized achievement tests?
260. Do you know if (minor male child) is a beneficiary of the UEP?
261. Do you know of any source of financial support for (minor male child)?
262. Returning to the school at YFZ, how many teachers at that school have a college education?
263. What is the age of the youngest teacher at that school?
264. What is the annual budget for the school?
265. How many of the male children of that school were in the 2007 high school graduating class?
266. What percentage of the male children in that school have completed high school?
267. When did Annette Jeffs first arrive at YFZ to live?
268. What is the address of the house that Annette Jeffs occupied during her residency at the YFZ ranch?
269. Who lived with her at that address?
270. Where was Annette Jeffs living at the time of the April (3), 2008 raid?
271. Where was Annette Jeffs living in July 2007?
272. Where was Annette Jeffs living in July 2006?
273. With whom was Annette Jeffs living in July 2006?

274. (Following questions asked by Natalie Malonis) Is your daughter X currently involved in a CPS custody case?
275. When was your last contact with your daughter X?
276. Would you like to talk to X?
277. Would you like to see X?
278. Have you personally ever added money to Warren Jeffs' commissary?
279. Has Annette Jeffs spoken to you about testifying on her behalf or on her children's behalf in one of the custody cases?

Unanswered questions from Merril Jessop's Jan. 23, 2009, deposition, Part Two:


99. I'm handing you Exhibit No. 4 again, and there is some handwriting on this page, do you recognize that handwriting?
100. I'm going to hand you Deposition Exhibit 13, which is two pages of handwriting, and ask if you recognize the handwriting that's in cursive.
101. Is that your handwriting?
102. Are there any aspects of members' lives that are not governed by the religious leader?
103. Are the members' expenses and payment of debts and so forth determined by the religious leaders?
104. Do the religious leaders of the FLDS religious association determine what gets purchased for individual members of the association?
105. Do the FLDS religious leaders determine what individual members can wear?
106. Do the religious leaders of the FLDS religious association determine what individual members can and cannot eat?
107. Do the FLDS religious leaders determine what vocations the individual members of the organization have?
108. Do the FLDS religious leaders determine where individual members of the association can live?
109. Do the FLDS religious leaders determine who individual members can associate with?
110. Do the FLDS religious leaders determine who can be married to whom among the individual members?

111. How many residential structures are there at the location known as the YFZ ranch?
112. What is the consequence if a male member of the FLDS loses his priesthood?
113. If a particular family who are members of the FLDS organization in Texas reside outside of the ranch may they remain in good standing within the religious association?
114. Would a teenage boy or girl member of the FLDS association in Texas have the independent ability to determine whether they go to college?
115. Are there any members currently within the FLDS Texas association who are attending college or graduate school?
116. Are there currently any FLDS members who are enrolled in college, currently enrolled?
117. Are there currently any FLDS members in Texas who are enrolled in a graduate program beyond college?
118. What is your highest level of education?
119. Do you have a high school degree?
120. Are you familiar with the finances of running the ranch and its constituent residences and buildings and operations?
121. What does the Short Creek Stake mean?
122. Based on your review with your counsel can you verify or deny any of the information contained on this sheet (Budget Estimate Short Creek Stake)?

123. Are you aware whether or not there are still tithes being collected and utilized towards the operation of the YFZ Ranch?
124. Is there any construction ongoing at the ranch?
125. Are you associated with a company called Johnny Beagley Construction?
126. Do you have a bank account in Texas?
127. Are you associated with a company called Reliance Electric?
128. Have you paid Ms. Hennington?
129. Have you paid any attorneys a retainer in the last six months in connection with any investigations into activities of the YFZ Ranch?
130. Have you made any payments out of a bank account within the last six months?
131. Do you have check writing authority on any bank accounts?
132. Do you drive an automobile?
133. Do you know who makes the payments for Ms. Annette Jeffs' house payments?
134. Do you have anything to do with the payment of Ms. Jeffs’ expenses?
135. Do you know if Ms. Jeffs has a job?
136. Do you have any awareness of whether Ms. Annette Jeffs has any access to financial resources outside of the control of the religious leaders of the FLDS?
137. Do you have frequent contact with Ms. Jeffs?
138. Have you ever been to that residence?
139. Did you personally have anything to do with securing that residence for her and her family to live in?
140. Do you personally have the ability to ask Ms. Jeffs and her family to vacate that residence?
141. If Teresa Jeffs decides not to return to the ranch will she remain a member in good standing of the FLDS?
142. Is there anybody other than Warren Jeffs who has the ability to conduct a marriage ceremony within the FLDS?
143. Is there any way for another person to assume the position of prophet of the FLDS while Warren Jeffs is still living?
144. If your son, Raymond Jessop, is convicted and is . . . and serves jail time will Teresa Jeffs be entitled to a release from her marriage to him?
145. Is Teresa Jeffs still married to Raymond Jessop?
146. Has Raymond Jessop ever been excluded from the FLDS branch and living there?
147. Is Raymond Jessop a member in good standing of the FLDS religious association?
148. Does Raymond Jessop hold priesthood?
149. Was Raymond Jessop ever your first counselor?
150. Is Raymond Jessop still your first counselor?
151. In the last four years have you resided in Mancos, Colorado?
152. (Regarding Exhibit No. 6) Can you tell me what your understanding of what House of Hiding means?
153. Have you ever been in charge of a house of hiding?
154. I've just handed you Exhibit No. 18. Can you identify that?
155. Have you ever heard of the United Effort Plan Trust?
156. Are you a member of the Beneficiary class of the United Effort Plan Trust?
157. Do you know if Ms. Annette Jeffs is part of the Beneficiary class of the United Effort Plan Trust?
158. Within the last month have you traveled to St. George, Utah, to meet with any representative of the Attorney General's Office of Utah?
159. Have you traveled out of the state of Texas with Wendell Nielsen in the last month?
160. At any time has a trust been formed to hold real or personal property of the FLDS within Texas?
161. Do you know if this draft was ever executed and made a trust instrument?
162. Do you know Isaac S. Jeffs?
163. Is your son, Raymond Jessop, to your knowledge, a trustee of any trust in Texas?
164. Do you know a person by the name of Sam Barlow?
165. Were you a member of the FLDS religious association on December 5, 1996?
166. Are you aware of a practice where men or women would use water to shut a child up when it cried, holding a child underwater or dunking them to stop the crying?
167. Are you aware of any member of the FLDS religious association having tied persons to chairs or trees or other kinds of physical restraints as a joke?
168. Are you aware of any member of the FLDS association using needles in a bed to pierce the skin and surprise someone?
169. Are you aware of a pattern of hitting children on the head as a way of parental control?
170. Are you aware of a practice of any adults in the FLDS association encouraging their older children to physically harm their younger children as a basis of punishment?
171. Are you aware of any adult members of the FLDS withholding food as a basis of punishment for their children?
172. Are you aware of any adult members of the FLDS force-feeing their children as a method of punishment?
173. Is Sam Barlow or was Sam Barlow a member of law enforcement to your knowledge?
174. All of those things that I just went over with you based on this document, have you ever engaged in any of those practices with your children?
175. And all of those things that I mentioned form that document, are any of those practices taught or encouraged within the FLDS organization?
176. Hands him Exhibit No. 20 (Nov. 10, 2000, deposition of Warren Jeffs) and asks: Does the prophet delegate any of his authority to perform ordinances within the FLDS?
177. What does it mean to be handled?
178. Has Warren Jeffs specifically practiced dividing families, separating mothers and children from fathers?
179. (On the exhibit) there are some handwritten notes and then at the bottom there's a signature. Can you identify that handwriting? Do you recognize it?
180. Do you recognize that signature (above name of Warren Jeffs)?
181. Do you know a person by the name of [female name excerpted] Barlow?
182. Do you know a person by the name of David Jeffs?
183. Do you have a son named David Jeffs?
184. If the prophet places a woman with a man to be sealed and that woman does not want that relationship does she have the authority to say no?
185. Under that same hypothetical, if that woman does say no what are the consequences to the woman?
186. Do you know a person by the name of Jim Allred?
187. Do you know if [female name] is married to Jim Allred?
188. If a woman desires to be released from her marriage how would she go about doing this?
189. Has any property owned by the UEP Trust been liquidated to purchase assets for the YFZ Ranch?
190. When you were recently in Utah who did you meet with?
191. Are you participating in negotiations of a settlement of UEP trust litigation?
192. Do you have a son named Ernest?
193. Was Ernest Jessop the bishop of the Texas group before you became bishop?
194. Was Ernest Jessop ever the bishop of the Texas FLDS group?

Okay, there were A LOT of questions not answered. I am going to break them into three posts.

There have been A LOT of discussions already about the implications of Merril taking the Fifth in response to questions during this deposition. Kurt Schulzke has a great explanation on his blog, Iperceive.net. In short, the Fifth is not an admission of guilt and a person can refuse to divulge information that could be used against them in a criminal prosecution.

But Judge Barbara Walther, contacted by telephone at one point during the deposition to rule on whether Merril had to answer the questions, made this comment: ''Because of how we construe the 5th Amendment, the court's understanding of the law it, in a civil case when a client or a witness claims a 5th Amendment privilege the trier of fact is entitled to make a more or less negative inference from making that assertion, unlike in a criminal case.''

The context within which the deposition took place is material:

Merril has been indicted for conducting an illegal marriage.
Raymon Jessop has been indicted for bigamy and sexual assault.
Teresa Jeffs still has a pending lawsuit regarding her custody.
Criminal investigations, both state and federal, are ongoing in Texas.
Criminal prosecutions are underway in Arizona.
Lawsuits regarding the UEP are pending in Utah (Elissa Wall's civil case) or in ''stand down'' status.
Prosecutions in Canada are just getting started.

So, here we go. Part one of questions not answered:

1. And how long have you lived there?
2. How long has that been the designation for that particular residence?
The judge later directed him to answer and Merril said: ''If I understand the question, I do not know.''
3. Did you live at this residence at that time, when law enforcement entered the property in April?
4. Did you live at the location known as the YFZ Ranch in . . . April of 2008?
5. Can you tell me all of your residences where you've lived in over the last four years?
6. In the last four years have you lived in any state other than Texas?
7. Have you at any time lived in Utah, in the state of Utah?
8. Are you the same Frederick Merril Jessop who is the bishop of the group called, known as the FLDS?
9. Please list all adults who you have lived with in the last four years.
10. How many children do you have?
11. Do you have any children under the age of 18?
12. Do you have any daughters?
13. How are you employed?
14. Do you have a source of income?
15. Do you own any assets?
16. Do you have any personal debt?
17. Are you a member of the FLDS religious association?
18. Do you have a religious association?
19. Do you worship a higher power?
20. Are you familiar with a person by the name of Warren Jeffs?
21. Are you familiar with the organization of the FLDS association?
22. How old is he? (His son Raymond.)
23. Is your son, Raymond, married to a young lady by the name of Teresa Jeffs?
24. Did you conduct a marriage ceremony of Raymond Jessop?
25. Did you witness the marriage of Raymond Jessop and Teresa Jeffs?
26. Do you know if he's lived at the YFZ Ranch in the last two years?
27. Do you know Teresa Jeffs?
28. Do you have a daughter named X (I am not using the name of the 14-year-old girl, who is in custody)?
29. Does this indictment that we talked about related to daughter X in any way?
30. Have Teresa Jeffs and Raymond Jessop had a child together?
31. Do you know how old Teresa is?
32. Is Warren Jeffs the prophet of the group known as FLDS?
33. What does the term prophet mean within the FLDS religious association?
34. Do you have an understanding of what the prophet is, what that term means?
35. What is a key holder within the FLDS religious association?
36. Do you know if records were kept by Warren Jeffs?
37. Is your daughter X married to Warren Jeffs?
38. When making an inference that she is married or hypothetically that she's married to Warren Jeffs, did she upon the happening of that event move into Warren Jeffs' home?
39. Was she (Naomie) at any time married to Warren Jeffs?
40. Where did that take place (face-to-face visit with Naomie)?
41. Was it in the state of Arizona that you saw Naomie approximately a month ago?
42. Does your daughter X have a child?
43. Are you aware of whether or not your daughter X has engaged in a sexual relationship with Warren Jeffs?
44. What is the meaning of heavenly wife?
45. What is the meaning of comfort wife?
46. Since Warren Jeffs has been in prison have any marriages taken place within the FLDS group in Texas?
47. Who among the FLDS has the authority to conduct a marriage ceremony or a sealing, however it's referred to within the group?
48. Do you have the authority to conduct marriages within the FLDS group?
49. How do you know Annette (Jeffs)?
50. How long have you known Annette Jeffs?
51. Do you know Annette Jeffs to be the mother, the biological mother of Teresa Jeffs?
52. What is the meaning of an ordinance?
53. Without telling me specifically what an ordinance is . . . is it a religious ceremony or event?
54. Is baptism an ordinance?
55. Is baptism an ordinance within the FLDS religious association?
56. Is marriage an ordinance within the FLDS religious association?
57. (Do you) recognize that to be what appears to be a marriage record that's kept by the FLDS religious association? (Marriage record listing Raymond Merril Jessop and Teresa Jeffs; conducted by Warren Jeffs; witnessed by Wendell Nielsen and Merril Jessop.)
58. What is your understanding of what R17 means?
59. Were you present at the ranch on July 27, 2006?
60. Do you know who Nephi Jeffs is?
61. What was the purpose of that visit (with Warren Jeffs in prison)?
62. When you visited him approximately a month ago did Warren Jeffs give you any instructions about how to conduct business among the FLDS religious association?
63. Approximately how many times have you visited Warren Jeffs since he's been incarcerated?
64. Who is William E. Jessop?
65. Do you know William E. Jessop?
66. Hands him Exhibit No. 6 (Father's Family Information Sheet) and asks if he recognizes it.
67. So you're not going to answer that question?
68. Are you familiar with an entity called YFZ Land LLC?
69. Have you ever registered a corporation in Texas?
70. What is your fear of incrimination answering a question about a corporation that is registered publicly?
71. Are you a member of the YFZ Land LLC?
72. Are you familiar with a mailing address of P.O. Box XXX, Eldorado, Texas, 76936?
73. Hands him Exhibit No. 8 and asks if he is familiar with it.
74. Are you familiar with a company called JeffsBusiness.com LTD?
75. Hands him Exhibit No. 7, listing officers of YFZ Land as David S. Allred, Joseph Steed, Merril Jessop and Raymond Jessop and asks if he can verify or deny any of the information on the page.
76. If I were to represent to you that this is a report from a public filing can you answer whether the Merril Jessop listed here is you?

77. Hands him Exhibit No. 9 (report from TaxNet USA on YFZ ranch) and asks him to verify or deny any of the information on it.

78. Do you know what is located at a street address (excerpted) in San Antonio?
79. Do you what what's located at street address (excerpted) in San Antonio?
80. Are you familiar with an entity referred to as the UEP or the United Effort Plan?
81. Do you know a Clay Jessop?
82. Hands him Exhibit No. 10 (tax certificate for Jessop Land Services LLC) and asks him to verify or deny information on it.
83. Are you familiar with an entity called Tonto Investments Inc.?
84. Have you ever been employed by or associated with as a director or member of manager of an entity called Tonto Investments?

85. Do you know if your son, Raymond Jessop, has ever been associated as an employee, member, director, officer, or manager of an entity called Tonto Investments?

86. Hands him Exhibit No 11 (tax certificate for Tonto Investments Inc.) and asks him to verify or deny its information.
87. Mr. Jessop, have you ever worked as a construction contractor?
88. Can you tell me what kinds of jobs you've had since you've been an adult?
89. Hands him Exhibit No. 12 (a note addressed Dear Brother Merril) and asks if he recognizes it.
90. Is that addressed, are you Brother Merril? Is that addressed to you?
91. Is that a note from Warren Jeffs to you?
92. Reads from Exhibit No. 4, a transcript of telephone call between Warren S. Jeffs and Nephi Jeffs, in which Warren places his family with Brother Merril. Have you ever heard that before?

93. Upon becoming aware of that conversation did you take any action?
94. What does it mean for Warren Jeffs' family to come under your direction?
95. Did you visit Warren Jeffs while he was incarcerated on January 24, 2007?
96. Reads excerpt from jailhouse transcript and asks: Did you take part in that conversation?
97. Have you and your daughter Naomie ever been together to visit Warren while he was incarcerated?
98. What is a second counselor?

Why question Merril Jessop in relation to Teresa Jeffs' situation? Here is how Natalie Malonis explained it to Judge Barbara Walther last week according to a transcript of the deposition:

''I think this witness has information about the way that the financial structure's set up and how my client and her family, their needs are taken care of, their living expenses, you know, how much control and choice they have over their own destinies. He's got information as an authority figure in the church over the structure of the church and that kind of thing. . . . He does have information that's relevant to how this family can support themselves, which goes to the safety of the child.''

The judge decided to let the deposition proceed and said she would rule later on any questions not answered. A hearing took place Monday on the unanswered questions, but Walther has not yet issued an order.

I went through the deposition to see for myself what kinds of questions Merril was asked and how they related to Teresa's case, which is already the subject of news and blog reports.

A lot of questions struck me as being posed on behalf of all the people who would like to depose Merril but have not been able to, such as many questions about the United Effort Plan Trust. What does a question about whether Merril was involved in the sale of the Apple Valley property in Utah have to do with Teresa Jeffs, for example? Likewise, of what relevance is it whether he still drives?

Any way, I listed all the questions in two categories: Those answered, and those to which Merril invoked the Fifth Amendment.

It is a long list, so I will break this into two posts. I will post one list now and, wow, it's late, the other later today.

First, the questions answered.

1. Would you go ahead and state your name on the record?
2. Are you here today under subpoena and a notice of deposition?
3. Have you seen that document or a copy of that document that I handed you or were the contents of it communicated by your counsel?
4. And that's how you knew that you were supposed to be here?
5. How would you prefer that I address you?
6. Do you go by Merril?
7. And what is your address, Merril?
8. What is the street that that residence is on?
9. Is that the building number or designation?
10. Do you know the zip code there?
11. This address that you gave me, is that a particular residence on the YFZ Ranch that was the subject of a law enforcement investigation since April of this year?
12. Are you following the advice of your counsel and choosing not to answer based on your Fifth Amendment right against incrimination?
13. And on all these questions when your counsel has invoked this privilege are you following in the advice of your counsel and choosing not to answer?
14. Are you following the advice of your counsel?
15. Are you following the advice of your counsel?
16. Do you have children?
17. Are you going to answer the question?
18. Do you have a son named Raymond Jessop?
19. And are you going to take the advice of counsel and not answer it?
20. Are you currently under indictment?
21. In Schleicher County or . . .
22. Have you seen that before? (A copy of his indictment.)
23. What is the charge that you’re currently under indictment for? Is the charge conducting a ceremony prohibited by law under the Texas Family Code, is that your understanding?
24. Do you know what you’re under indictment for? Have the charges been explained to you?
25. And it is conducting a ceremony prohibited by law, is that the charge?
26. Not have you done that, but is that the charge, is that what they’re accusing you of?
27. Are you currently under indictment for any other charges?
28. Does your indictment that we just talked about, does that relate to Raymond Jessop at all?
29. Does it related to any of your other children?
30. Do you know where Raymond Jessop lives currently?
31. Are you taking the advice of your counsel and choosing not to answer that question?
32. Is that on the basis that it might incriminate you, is that your understanding?
33. Do you recognize what that is? (Shows Merril ''Private Priesthood Record of President Warren S. Jeffs Record, January 2007 through June 6, 2007.'')
34. Do these appear to be the kinds of records that are kept within the FLDS? (Merril's response: ''I've never seen any like it.'')
35. Have you ever kept any records within the FLDS?
36. Do you have a daughter named Naomie?
37. Do you know what state Naomie lives in?
38. When was the last time you saw her face-to-face?
39. A month ago?
40. Was it in the state of Texas that you saw Naomie approximately a month ago?
41. Do you know Annette (Jeffs)?
42. Are you subscribing to what she is stating, that you're not going to answer those questions because you fear that it's going to incriminate you?
43. Hands Merril Exhibit No. 4, Motion in Limine from Jeffs' Utah trial (a transcript of Jeffs' jailhouse conversation with his brother Nephi Jeffs) and asks if he's seen it before.
44. You don't recognize it?
45. Have you ever visited Warren Jeffs since he's been in prison?
46. When was the last time you visited him?
47. About a month ago?
48. Do you have an understanding of whether Texas corporations are registered publicly or are of public record?
49. Are you not going to answer that question?
50. And is the reason for that because of a fear of self-incrimination?
51. Mr. Jessop, are you okay?
52. Are you hearing my questions?
53. Are you awake?
54. Can you state specifically what offense he might be in fear, or let the witness state what he is afraid of being incriminated by answering directly whether he drives an automobile? (Merril's answer: ''Probably because I can't see.'')
55. Do you know where Ms. Annette Jeffs and her children live, what city?
56. Do your bond conditions prohibit you from traveling outside of Texas? (''No.'')
57. Are there any conditions to your bond? (''No.'')
58. Did you review that (document titled Declaration of Trust of the United Order Trust of Texas) with your counsel?
59. Do you recall the date that the investigation began when law enforcement first came on the ranch, do you remember the date?
60. (Following questions asked by Jonathan R. Davis, ad litem for a minor male sibling) Would you state your date of birth, please.
61. And where were you born?
62. And did you go to elementary school?
63. Where did you go to elementary school?
64. And did you go to high school?
65. Did you finish through, what, seventh or eighth grade, something like that? (''Eighth grade.'')
66. Is there a grocery store at the YFZ Ranch? (''There is a storehouse.'')
67. (Asked by Natalie Malonis and answered by Merril's attorney) Have you been personally served with citation in a CPS case involving X (a minor daughter)?
68. Are you aware you're listed as a witness in some discovery documents n any of the CPS cases? (''I'm not aware.'')
69. You haven't had a discussion about testifying? (Nods.)
70. So somebody's talked to you about what facts you would testify about? (''No.'')
71. When your counsel has invoked the Fifth Amendment privilege on your behalf, I just want to clarify that on all of those questions it is your choice not to answer those because of a fear of incriminating yourself? (''It's my choice to follow the counsel's direction.'')
72. What I want to know is that on each of those questions is your choice not to answer because your answer could incriminate you? (''On the advice of counsel I would answer yes.'')
73. Is that correct, based on her explanation of the law to you, you don't want to answer those questions because it might incriminate you? (''As I understand it, yes.'')

During Merril Jessop's deposition last week, Natalie Malonis introduced as exhibits a number of documents that I don't recall hearing about in previous court sessions or filings:

A budget estimate for the Short Creek Stake
A trust document for a property trust in Texas
A 1996 statement from Sam Barlow
A transcript of a March 23, 2008, lesson given by Warren Jeffs to family and friends during a visit at the Mohave County Jail, just days before the raid.

Where did they come from? Is the trust document a public document? A search begins tomorrow.

What's in all these documents? And will there be an effort to seal them before we can get a peek?

There are a number of interesting questions here, particularly regarding the Arizona jailhouse transcript of a conversation that occurred days before the raid in Texas. Did it have any bearing on events?

So I'm reading through the transcript of Merril Jessop's deposition (thanks Paul!) and come across this exchange:

Malonis: Are you familiar with a company called JeffsBusiness.com LTD?

Amy Hennington, Merril's attorney: Upon the advice of counsel my client is invoking his right to assert the privilege against self-incrimination pursuant to the Fifth Amendment of the United States Constitution, as well as the state of Texas Constitution; the basis for the exertion of this privilege is the federal and state search warrants and the ongoing . . . that have been issued relating to matters here in Schleicher County back in April of 2008, the ongoing investigations that have resulted from those search warrants.


Okay, clue me in: Who is Jeff "Shecky'' Schechter and what does he have to do with Teresa Jeffs, or the FLDS for that matter? After looking at his Web page, the answer appears to me to be nothing. So have at it and set me straight.

Well, well. A new mess is brewing in Texas.

Someone leaked a copy of Merril Jessop's deposition, taken by Natalie Malonis last week, to Paul Anthony of the San Angelo Standard.

Malonis also apparently gave an excerpt of the deposition transcript to Kurt Schulzke, who has the iperceive blog. Malonis posted several comments on the blog in which she names some children whose cases have been nonsuited and discusses issues related to the depositions.

I checked with the Tom Green County court clerk who oversees the FLDS filings and was told there is quite a stir over the fact the depositions were released. The judge has the depositions on her desk, I was told, and had not placed them in the case file or authorized their release. She has yet to rule on whether Merril Jessop should be required to answer questions on which he pleaded the Fifth Amendment.

The relevance of many questions (the financing of the ranch, whether or not he drives, etc.) is a real mystery, since the case is about Teresa Jeffs, who turns 18 in July.

Other questions are relevant, such as whether Teresa Jeffs and Raymond Jessop, Merill's son, have a child together.

When asked that question, Amy Hennington, Merril's attorney, said her client would not answer because of pending criminal charges. Both men have been indicted.

I spoke earlier today to Willie Jessop, who told me that Merril's deposition had hit the Internet even before his own deposition took place.

''It did not come from the FLDS,'' he said. ''The court admonished all parties to not release this transcript.''

It is looking like a busy week for Flora Jessop.

On Wednesday, she is being deposed in Arizona.

On Tuesday, her book ''Church of Lies'' was due to be released today.

You can order the book on Amazon but I have not yet seen it in book stores. I went searching around, however, and found the book index, chapter list and first chapter on line at the publisher's Web site.

The first chapter, titled 'The End of Innocence,' starts off with a description of her baptism at age 8 and then quickly moves into uncomfortable territory as Flora describes how her father began molesting her that same year. Flora is gut-wrenchingly graphic as she describes what happened.

Why didn't she cry out for help? Flora blames the Keep Sweet mantra of the community. Here is an excerpt:

'' 'Keep Sweet' is the sacred song of the church, preached with relentless passion,'' Flora writes. ''It covers a multitude of sins. It means be modest and pure; obey your parents; obey your husband. But to me and thousands of other abused kids, keep sweet meant keep silent as your father is molesting you. Say nothing as your mom or dad beats you with their fists, a belt, a steel pipe.''

The chapters listed on the Jossey-Bass Web site include: Little Runaway, No One's Property, Ruby, Rescuing the Fawns, Laurene and Fighting On.

The index to the book is also online, and that gave me an even better idea of the subject matter that the book will cover.

Here is a sampling:

People

Germaine Abraham-Leveen
Jenny Larsen
Dan Barlow
Grandma Bertha
Jay Beswick
Linda Binder
Winston Blackmore
Fawn Broadbent
Jesus Christ
Don & Katie Cox
Bob Curran
Rowenna Erickson
Jeffrey Holland
Joni Holm
Warren Jeffs
27 Jessops, including herself
Jon Krakauer
Mary Magdalene
Major (her horse)
Brian David Mitchell
Jim Osman
Ron Parker (Wonder if that is supposed to be Rod Parker?)
Hester Prynne
John Quinones
Sam Roundy
Mark Shurtleff
Elizabeth Smart
Allen Steed
Rosita Swinton (page 279)
Linda Walker
Mike Watkiss
Les Zitting


Topics:

Babyland
Barbiturates
Blood atonement
Child abuse
Cocaine
Denny's restaurant
Drugs (pages 122-125, 132, 135, 139, 141, 157, 236, 281)
Fumerase deficiency
God Squad (almost as many mentions as drugs)
Jealousy
Lost Boys
Midwest Italian Mafia
Ovulation tests
Penthouse magazine
Poofers
Ruby Ridge
Unconditional love
Utah Supreme Court
Welfare fraud

Flora's playlist:

Air Supply
Pat Benetar
Best of the Beach Boys
Black Sabbath
Go-Go's
Bob Seger
Surfin' USA (Beach Boys)
Turn the Page

Phoenix men's clubs:

Centerfolds
Mr. Lucky's
Tiffany's Cabaret

Other places:

Arizona
Binion's Horseshoe Casino
British Columbia
California
Canaan Mountain
Coral Pink Sand Dunes
Death Highway
Eldorado
Eudora, Kansas
Fredonia
Independence, Missouri
Ivins, Utah
Jacob Lake, Arizona (very pretty place! Hopefully, nothing bad went on there . . . )
Kansas City, Miss.
Little Cottonwood Canyon
Mexico
Pacific Beach, Calif.
Springfield, Miss
Tonopah, Ariz.
Zion National Park

I am giving you a heads up about changes looming for my blog. Trent has been hard at work on a new design using WordPress.

Photos by Trent Nelson

Last May, I walked into the Tom Green County Courthouse where court hearings in the FLDS cases were about to get underway.

I sat on a bench next to a couple women, both of whom I recognized. Other reporters were milling about, so I quietly said to one of the women: ''Hello. I know who you are but I am not going to say a word."

She said, ''Thank you.''

It was Betty Jessop, and I recognized her from a picture in her mother Carolyn's book.

I have wanted to interview Betty ever since. I had the same question lots of people do: Why did she return to the FLDS?

I get telephone calls and emails regularly from people across the country who have read Carolyn's book ''Escape'' and want to know what happened to Betty and why she went back to her father, Merril Jessop. I know people are very interested in her story.

And now she is preparing to tell it. I wrote a story in today's paper about Betty and her work on a book about her experiences. I have now interviewed her twice: Once briefly in August after Barbara Jessop's daughter was returned to state custody (Betty was living with Barbara); and earlier this month at the Yearning For Zion Ranch in Eldorado.

I have read a handful of chapters she has written for her book, which does not yet have a publisher. They were insightful and revealing, both about Betty, her family and her world view.

What's Betty like? Lively, opinionated, funny, sweet, determined. As we spoke at the ranch, a cluster of other young women often gathered around Betty, beaming at her.

Here is one story she told me about why she decided to write the book, but that did not make today's article:

Betty was getting ready to move to Texas when the raid occurred. On April 5, she was at a brother's home, and was searching the Internet for news clips about the raid.

''I saw mother on the news giving her ideas about the raid, and it, well, it infuriated me, to a whole different degree! She had put me through hell for five years and when I finally broken free, she turned around and helped do it to my entire family and community,'' Betty wrote me in an email. ''I had to work with myself not to call her up and scream at her. I had to pray hard to calm myself down.''

Instead, Betty sent her mother a text message. ''How much did you have to do with the raid?'' she asked.

Ten minutes passed. No reply.

So she said she sent a second message.

''I looked down at my phone and started to write. It took me about five minutes to think of what I could say that had power behind every word. This is what I came up with: 'I have always wondered what I would tell my future generations about my mother. It's a sad story that the fact of the matter is, she did everything in her power to destroy the chance of their existence!'

Betty told me her mother did not respond, ''at least not directly.'' The next day, Betty saw another news interview with her mother.

''This time she talked about me, and how I burned through twelve counselors because I was so brainwashed. So, the message I sent, I believe she heard it loud and clear, and it made her mad!''

''Like I have told you before, if you don't support her or have the same opinion, YOU'RE BRAINWASHED!''

Carolyn Jessop declined to speak with me about Betty, but says in her book she considers her daughter brainwashed and holds out hope she will come back to her some day.

Here is the story from Paul Anthony we ran today about Natalie Malonis' deposition of Merril Jessop yesterday in San Angelo.

FLDS leader wants to plead the Fifth Sect
Jessop's attorneys argue he shouldn't have to answer financial questions.

By Paul A. Anthony

San Angelo Standard-times
Updated: 01/23/2009 09:14:07 PM MST

San Angelo, Texas

Even after eight hours in a Schleicher County courtroom Friday, the deposition of YFZ Ranch leader Merril Jessop may not be over.

Attorneys for the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Later-Day Saints elder and his alleged teenage daughter-in-law will argue in court Monday over whether Jessop should be able to plead Fifth Amendment protection to a series of questions regarding the polygamous sect's financial structure.

"There are quite a few [answers] that are in controversy," said Natalie Malonis, the Denton, Texas, attorney representing a 17-year-old daughter of FLDS leader Warren Jeffs. "He answered some of it. I hope that on Monday when we have our hearing,[the judge] will compel answers."

District Judge Barbara Walther set the hearing, Malonis said, after compelling testimony in a 30-minute telephone proceeding on some efforts by Jessop to plead the Fifth, which protects witnesses from being forced to give answers under oath that could incriminate them.

The sect's own documents describe the girl as having been married to Jessop's 36-year-old son. Jessop, 72, has been indicted by a Schleicher County grand jury on charges of orchestrating an illegal marriage ceremony involving a different underage girl.

Malonis said she has not contested all of Jessop's Fifth Amendment pleadings, but that she asked Walther to compel testimony on questions of the sect's
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finances.

"He may be the only person who can answer that information," she said.

Malonis has said she is looking for ways to provide her client with financial options once she turns 18 in July.

Jessop's criminal attorney, Amy Hennington of San Angelo, who represented him during the civil deposition, could not be reached for comment.

Testimony began about 9 a.m. and the gaggle of attorneys, representing Jessop, the state's Child Protective Services agency, the girl and her mother, Annette Jeffs, left the courthouse just before 5 p.m.

Jessop has been the leader of the ranch since the Jeffs' 2006 arrest and has long been considered the self-styled prophet's chief deputy. The reclusive figure is one of 12 FLDS men indicted on evidence seized in a weeklong April raid on the ranch by CPS investigators and the Texas Rangers.

Authorities removed 439 children from the ranch, and although most have been returned, a handful of custody cases, including the one involving the 17-year-old girl, remain pending in Tom Green County district court.

About 1,300 people answered the question about how often they feel God's love in the 2004 General Social Survey.

Here is what they said:

Many times a day: 21 percent

Every day: 29 percent

Most days: 14 percent

Some days: 10 percent

Once in a while: 11 percent

Never or almost never: 15 percent

That same year, the survey asked the same group a related question: "In general, how close do you feel to God?"

The results:

Not at all close: 11 percent

Somewhat close: 36 percent

Very close: 36 percent

As close as possible: 17 percent

Tom Hanks, producer of HBO's "Big Love," has apologized for his comments about the LDS Church's involvement in the Prop 8 campaign.

In an exclusive with People magazine, Hanks said he should not have called that involvement "un-American."

Among the films previewing at the Sundance Film Festival is a 11-minute short called ''Sister Wife.'' Here is the festival blurb about it.

I spoke with DoriAnn, the subject of the film and a resident of Centennial Park, about why she agreed to participate and the film's message. She asked that I not use her last name.

The hope is the short is intriguing enough to draw funding for a full-length documentary. The mini-film shows DoriAnn preparing for and entering her daily bath, a ''re-birthing practicing connected breathing, releasing emotional energy.''

DoriAnn, 41 and the mother of 12, told me she met director Jill Orschel in 2005 at a self-improvement workshop. Jill lives in Park City and has made two documentaries, one about becoming a parent called ''The Places You'll Go'' and another called ''Lakota Workcamp,'' about teenagers on a reservation involved in a community project.

''We really connected immediately,'' she said. Initially, Jill had no idea DoriAnn was a plural wife. But soon she proposed doing a film about DoriAnn's life.

DoriAnn said it took several years for her to feel comfortable enough to agree to work with Jill on a film. She did everything she could to get another family for Jill, but in the end DoriAnn agreed.

DoriAnn said her husband and sister wife, her younger sister, do not want anything to do with the project but support her participation.

The preview explores the ''dualities between the shadow sides and enlightened sides" of her life, DoriAnn said. It is not so much about plural marriage as it is about life, she said.

"I would love to share more about the empowerment I discovered in a quest to know myself and others consciously and the effects of our human conditioning," she told me in an email. "My intention is to be an example of loving compassion for the human experience, while learning the Art of Receiving and Giving Love Authentically, practicing being Soulkeepers with ourselves, our beloveds, our children, our friends, our community and our world."

She has seen the film and said it was hard to watch because "it expresses so intensely human emotion.''

"This film is about honoring my culture, honoring other people's culture, about learning we don't have to be a threat to one another so we can live in a you-and-me world."

DoriAnn was born and raised in Colorado City, Ariz. When she was 15, her parents moved to Nevada. Family troubles resulted in her being placed in state custody for a time. At 16, she ran away from home and hitchhiked back to Colorado City.

''All I could think about was I had to get back to where it was safe," she said.

She eventually went to live with relatives in Mexico. DoriAnn married at 16 and had eight children with her first husband before their marriage ended in divorce.

She entered plural marriage about nine years ago.

''My reason for choosing plural marriage is the ability to love other women as much as I love myself and to love another woman's children as much as I love my own," she said. Plural marriage allows her to "love big, bigger than any other experience could teach me. To love and not have to have ownership of love, ownership of another human being."

What is the reaction to the film?

Mary Batchelor, a co-founder of Principle Voices, saw it the other night and said it was ''powerful.''

"Not very many women in plural marriage are willing to go that public with those feelings," Batchelor said. "I was very impressed with her courage in doing that. It was very real and brutally honest.

"I felt it was at once painful and hard to watch but at the same time awe-inspiring and powerful," she said.

The imagery is of coming clean, a disrobing of self as vulnerable and washing away painful feelings, Batchelor said.